The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality. (2 Viewers)

[littlebigpsycho]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

We may sit here and talk about the human rights issues that occur in mainland china, but when a nation is brought to make or break alliances or even when its own existence is threatened these trivial questions do not matter.

"Human Rights" and "trivial".
The fact that you can put these two words in the same sentence in a political context.....

What do you believe in? Would you really give up your rights just to live under a "safe" government.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

"Human Rights" and "trivial".
The fact that you can put these two words in the same sentence in a political context.....

What do you believe in? Would you really give up your rights just to live under a "safe" government.

Hahaha
Savak's a realist. Unlike you, who lives in a cottage in fairy-land, hunts unicorns for a living and fucks the occasional elf.
He's right too. Nations don't give a shit about human rights when making deals between each other. It's all just rhetoric. Case in point: Olympics Opening Ceremony last year. There was talk about a boycott by major world leaders over China's abysmal human rights record. But who ended up boycotting? Steven Speilberg and the Japanese royal family. Big fucking whoop-de-doo.
In the real world, pragmatism comes before humanism, darl. Accept it, move on.

 

[littlebigpsycho]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

I dare say I would know more of the real world then yourself, but you go ahead and make presumptions and continue to live without care. I would argue with you but your signature suggests it would be pointless.

Martin Niemöller:
"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up."

I have no further comments to add to this argument.

 

[Rasengan2dabalz]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Nah lets ally with China.
Im in the mood for some Asian pussy.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

I dare say I would know more of the real world then yourself,

Hahahaha what? Pray tell, how did you come to such a conclusion?

but you go ahead and make presumptions and continue to live without care.

Quite the contrary, actually. I'm an ardent humanist and I value all life, including the life of animals, to be sacred. But I'm also a realist, so I can recognise that not all others do so.

I would argue with you but your signature suggests it would be pointless.

Why? Because I created an objective, unbiased and rational group about the Israeli conflict?
Or is it the quote about Life and Death? Just because I don't fear death doesn't mean an argument with me is pointless. Many would argue the opposite actually.

Martin Niemöller:
"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up."

That's all well and good, if you were living in Germany between 1933 and 1945. Fortunately, we do not, and there is no chance in hell that the Chinese government is going to be coming after us.
Niemoller's basic preimse is one of humanism for the sake of self-preservation. Where is our self-preservation in trying to stop the Chinese from hurting their own people? Niemoller himself was a pragmatist, so I highly doubt even he would be taking your side. So please don't distort his views for your own ends.

I have no further comments to add to this argument.

Hahaha
Of course you don't! After all, arguing with someone who believes the opposite of what you do is hard work, especially when you know that he is not going to change his views. Hell, maybe you're even concerned that I will change your views, seeing as how my argument isn't based upon wishful thinking and ignorance, and is instead based upon those age old temptations for the intellect; Logic and Pragmatism.

 

[4lettersdown]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Nah lets ally with China.
Im in the mood for some Asian pussy.

my good sir, I beleive you hath purloined my mouth-words.

but seriously, has anyone noticed how sexual the adverts here are? in the homosexuals thread it was all "gay dating" and then here it looks like an asian bride service.

oh and voted China but beleive neutrality is more politically realistic

 

[mrcalkin]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

China will collapse prettty fast, as the current economic crisis shows, china is in deep trouble.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

China will collapse prettty fast, as the current economic crisis shows, china is in deep trouble.

[citation needed]
China won't collapse. Politically, you misunderestimate the Chinese Government and their ability to control the masses, and you also overestimate how much the Chinese people dislike authoritarianism and actually desire change. Economically, China's in a far better position than many other countries, with America liable to continue to rely on it for borrowings, whilst it has already begun injecting billions to stimulate the economy, with plenty of room to still move.
China won't collapse.

 

[Riet]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Debate is meaningless. Neither country could successfully invade the other which means the only possible end to such a conflict = nuclear war = fallout3.

 

[Iron]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Taiwan is obviously the issue where our allegiances are conflicted. That doesnt have to come to nuclear war

 

[jules.09]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

The poll says "stay neutral". But Australia, isn't neutral for starters.

Australia may well geographically pertain to the Asia-Pacific but in terms of our politics and culture, it's very Westernised. We've yet to become a republic let alone side with China. And anyway, China has an appalling human rights record, and the younger generation today are completely oblivious to all this, thanks to communist re-education.

It's kind of early to forecast much but, if possible, I'd like to think Australia will be neutral in future.

 

[SAVAK]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

The poll says "stay neutral". But Australia, isn't neutral for starters.

Australia may well geographically pertain to the Asia-Pacific but in terms of our politics and culture, it's very Westernised. We've yet to become a republic let alone side with China. And anyway, China has an appalling human rights record, and the younger generation today are completely oblivious to all this, thanks to communist re-education.

It's kind of early to forecast much but, if possible, I'd like to think Australia will be neutral in future.

I have already touched upon this issue in the first post, and Moll has also gone over it. read the thread.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

The poll says "stay neutral". But Australia, isn't neutral for starters.

Australia may well geographically pertain to the Asia-Pacific but in terms of our politics and culture, it's very Westernised. We've yet to become a republic let alone side with China. And anyway, China has an appalling human rights record, and the younger generation today are completely oblivious to all this, thanks to communist re-education.

It's kind of early to forecast much but, if possible, I'd like to think Australia will be neutral in future.

I do hope you're talking about the Chinese youth here, not Australians. Because that's just blatantly false if the latter.

 

[Riet]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

I do hope you're talking about the Chinese youth here, not Australians. Because that's just blatantly false if the latter.

Nah I'm against youthinasia.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Nah I'm against youthinasia.

r0fLc0PteR!!!1

 

[jules.09]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

The United States on the other hand, has an impeccable human rights.......oh wait.

Australia's essentially fledgling America. Waging war on the world was God's way of teaching America geography. No, I'm quite anti-American, in terms of its politics, culture and whatever else.

And moll, of course I'm referring to the Chinese youth. But even then, most people are oblivious to modern Chinse history anyway? I'm perfectly serious about that. A lot of my chinese peers are completely oblivious about the Red Guards and the Cultural Revolution. If anything, they're telling me that Westerners have been lying to degrade their country.

 

[Riet]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Its cool to be Anti-American.

 

[SAVAK]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Australia's essentially fledgling America. Waging war on the world was God's way of teaching America geography. No, I'm quite anti-American, in terms of its politics, culture and whatever else.

And moll, of course I'm referring to the Chinese youth. But even then, most people are oblivious to modern Chinse history anyway? I'm perfectly serious about that. A lot of my chinese peers are completely oblivious about the Red Guards and the Cultural Revolution. If anything, they're telling me that Westerners have been lying to degrade their country.

you make it sound like western Europe is innocent.
and most of your peers are probably a bunch of international students.

 

[Riet]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

PS from my experience most Chinese students are just as ignorant, racist and prejudice as Americans, if not more so.

 

[moll.]

Re: The Future is the past - where should Australia stand? USA, China, or neuetrality

Australia's essentially fledgling America. Waging war on the world was God's way of teaching America geography. No, I'm quite anti-American, in terms of its politics, culture and whatever else.

And moll, of course I'm referring to the Chinese youth. But even then, most people are oblivious to modern Chinse history anyway? I'm perfectly serious about that. A lot of my chinese peers are completely oblivious about the Red Guards and the Cultural Revolution. If anything, they're telling me that Westerners have been lying to degrade their country.

That's just cos Australians are uneducated idiots.