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hardworking Vs. intelligence (4 Viewers)

hairspray

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At our school, since dux is pre-determined, to be dux you have to be:
1. Smart
2. Liked by the Principal
3. Loved by the Principal
4. Not piss the principal off

Last year our "dux" (girl 1) got 97 (point something)UAI but the girl (girl 2) that got the highest UAI got 99.35, rumors has it that the principal didn't give girl 2 dux cos she went tutoring at a college that the principal hates..."pal college". Although people can see this is an honest mistake since 97 is a GREAT UAI, it was obvious to everyone that girl 2 should've gotten dux, she came first in all the science subjects and got all these awards from unis b4 even attending them and scholarship offers...
 

Hagaren

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[FONT=&quot]My very first post on here^^
[FONT=&quot]Well, I have always been curious about which quality people value more, hardworking, or intelligence?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Consider this scenario. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The dux of my school this year has been really tough competition. Person 1, does Biology, Adv English, Dance, IPT& Chemistry. Person 2, does Physics, Chemistry, 4U maths, and Adv English.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They are both in my chem class, and from the depth of their grasp of concepts (also how quickly), quality of questions asked in class, ability to solve the out-of-ordinary questions, test scores, and of course just the way they talk, I think person 2 is way more intellectually talented. She had really bad flu one week before the trials, and yet still topped the class with a 91% (for chem), while person 1, who studied her ass off by staying up till 3am everyday for a whole week to study for it (that’s what she said anyway), only managed a 77%. Person 2 is also really good at maths- she is topping all her maths +physics classes, especially 4U and physics - she is like 10% ahead of the second for both. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They are both not topping English though lol. I think person 1 is about 6/80 and person 2 is like 10/80. Person 1 is topping dance and IPT though…She was topping Biology too, but then got beaten by 1%.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]BUT person 1 studies SO hard! She is ALWAYS in the library doing past papers/writing notes/reading textbook. She would stay up really late to study for tests…and her normal bed time is about 2am. And I know she’s not just saying that, you could actually tell because she has started to get acnes and really bad eye bags this year. She puts so much effort into all her majors and assignments too, like going through about 10 drafts for all her essays. Person 2 is heaps slack in comparison…I think if the ranks are based on the effort one puts in; she wouldn’t even make it to the top 10- she goes out, parties, and is on MSN all the time.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Person 2 ended up getting the dux- no surprise really, she’s really intelligent. But now many people are saying that person 1 deserves it more because she put all that effort into it, and so it’s not fair for her because being less intelligent is not her fault.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]So what do you think?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And apart from the scenario itself, which quality do you think is more important in general and for HSC? Hardworking, or natural intellectual abilities?[/FONT]
[/FONT]
I hate fuckwits who ask obvious questions such as this, if you don't win you don't win.

Don't give me all that less intelligent bullshit, you either do what you need to do to win or you loose it's that simple. Hardwork, is of course a more admiral trait and truthfully a more important one.

Person 2 probably did put the work in she just never felt like she should brag about it.

I also hate fuckwits who present arguments like this.
 

evilflic

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oh wow

dux is not an effort award, dux is awarded to the top student - the student who gets the best marks. Whilst this can be difficult to ascertain, with varying subjects, putting in effort means nothing - if you don't get the marks, you don't get the marks.
I beg to differ. Our dux did not get the highest marks this year (although she's topped in other years), but she definitely put in the most effort. Dux at our school is a reward for effort which has resulted in very high - but not necessarily the highest - marks.
 

pman

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I beg to differ. Our dux did not get the highest marks this year (although she's topped in other years), but she definitely put in the most effort. Dux at our school is a reward for effort which has resulted in very high - but not necessarily the highest - marks.
Dux is about marks, nothing more!
 

EmJoy

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At our school, since dux is pre-determined, to be dux you have to be:
1. Smart
2. Liked by the Principal
3. Loved by the Principal
4. Not piss the principal off

Last year our "dux" (girl 1) got 97 (point something)UAI but the girl (girl 2) that got the highest UAI got 99.35, rumors has it that the principal didn't give girl 2 dux cos she went tutoring at a college that the principal hates..."pal college". Although people can see this is an honest mistake since 97 is a GREAT UAI, it was obvious to everyone that girl 2 should've gotten dux, she came first in all the science subjects and got all these awards from unis b4 even attending them and scholarship offers...
Personally I think that is really unfair. =[

I beg to differ. Our dux did not get the highest marks this year (although she's topped in other years), but she definitely put in the most effort. Dux at our school is a reward for effort which has resulted in very high - but not necessarily the highest - marks.
How can one's effort be fairly and accurately measured? For example, someone can claim that s/he studies 24/7, yet fail all the exams, and still get dux? lol!
 

evilflic

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Personally I think that is really unfair. =[



How can one's effort be fairly and accurately measured? For example, someone can claim that s/he studies 24/7, yet fail all the exams, and still get dux? lol!
Obviously, very high marks are a prerequisite. They basically look at the top 5 people, consult with their teachers about the amount of effort they've been putting in + consistency of marks and effort, have a look at their past highschool academic performance, and then decide who'll come dux.

To the person below who said 'dux is all about marks': that is bullshit at my school.

Edit: and effort can be pretty accurately gauged based upon attitude in class etc.
 
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Winn

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Hehe, another discussion about dux :D
Well, for the sake of this argument, I doubt anyone can get an ATAR of 99+ without hardcore studying. I mean, though the marks may not be necessarily directly proportional to the effort put in, it certainly is highly reflective. It's just that some people study without telling the whole world that they are, and they study effectively and efficiently, XD.
Hence I think the dux should be awarded to the most academically successful student.
Also, you are welcome to prove me wrong- but I certainly believe an extremely intelligent person who does not study at all, will NOT get the highest marks. The HSC is not an IQ test.
 

evilflic

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Hehe, another discussion about dux :D
Well, for the sake of this argument, I doubt anyone can get an ATAR of 99+ without hardcore studying. I mean, though the marks may not be necessarily directly proportional to the effort put in, it certainly is highly reflective. It's just that some people study without telling the whole world that they are, and they study effectively and efficiently, XD.
Hence I think the dux should be awarded to the most academically successful student.
Also, you are welcome to prove me wrong- but I certainly believe an extremely intelligent person who does not study at all, will NOT get the highest marks. The HSC is not an IQ test.
But you can still get decent marks (98+) without studying much. You just have to study the right way. I rarely did homework this year, and my study = about 4 hours worth of work a week, but I'm expecting 98+ (but happy with anything 96+). Study method is more important than study hours.
And yeah, the HSC is not an IQ test. It's a memory test, no matter what the BOS wants us to believe.
 

addicts

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yeah i think a mix would be desirable but honestly it comes down to circumstance .. i suppose..

but remember.. just because person 2 became dux.. and may be good at school that isn't always a garuntee that they will succeed in uni.. or if they get a job.. they may not be willing to work as hard as say person 1 who is used to working hard.. so in the end person 1 may eventually get ahead.. its upsetting but a lot of things in life are. wow that sounds depressing.. : )

xx addicts
 

shady145

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same goes for the people that get 95% in an exam and claim that they didnt study.
what about mathematics. just normal not ext1 or 2
its easy to do, at my school atleast(they give pretty weak exams)
 

annabackwards

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what about mathematics. just normal not ext1 or 2
its easy to do, at my school atleast(they give pretty weak exams)
That is very true, close to no study for 2U is needed.

Same thing for topic tests on topics that you've just done - if you have a good memory it'll be fresh in your mind.
 

lyounamu

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intelligence ftw but not everyone has it. i need to resort to mix of both for example.
 
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Aquawhite

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depends on what type of intelligence.

for example, i don't have much common sense but i have good memory. even with maths, i just go through tonnes of past papers, circle ones that i cannot do and memorise the solution.

understanding? screw that =(
LOL haha. Lies!
 

duckcowhybrid

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We have multiple Duxes, basically it's whoever got the highest UAI/ATAR, for example last year we had 8 100s so we had 8 Duxes. it's really funny actually to see our Dux board.
 

HTB

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intelligence > hardworking

I know this for a fact because most of the people only do on average about half an hour of study every night for most of year 12 and we're still in the top 10 schools every year
 

EmJoy

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intelligence > hardworking

I know this for a fact because most of the people only do on average about half an hour of study every night for most of year 12 and we're still in the top 10 schools every year
How would you know?
 

kwokie

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A retard will beat a genius with hard work. Intelligence is not something we could change, but the amount of work we put in are. Also U cant make it through any of the hsc course with intelligence alone....
 

jeshxcore

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How do you study effectively?
I read textbook, print notes and read notes too, summarize.. do questions off textbook... yeah..
But i only do this before exam.. i guess i should be doing this method everyday next year and in year 12.
 

lychnobity

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How do you study effectively?
I read textbook, print notes and read notes too, summarize.. do questions off textbook... yeah..
But i only do this before exam.. i guess i should be doing this method everyday next year and in year 12.
If you want effective cramming techniques, I can help you with that.

I'm not consistent at all, so beyond that, I'm not of much help

"Typing up notes for each lesson at the end of everyday?"
yes


This is something i'v spent the last few years testing and perfecting, but a system/method for study.

Create a word document, and make a shortcut for it on your desktop in some highly accessible place.

A single document.

Now what you want to do, is the first lesson of the year (or whenever you start this system), you write notes in class whatever, and type them into the word document, ALL notes, from ALL subjects, into the one word document.

At the bottom write the letters "eeee" where the digit is should be ONE DAY after the day the notes were typed up, put a comma,

and type in eeee where digit 2 is the date THREE DAYS after the date it was typed up,

finally put a comma type eeee where digit three is the date ONE WEEK after the notes were typed up.


Now highlight these three "eeee" statements. These are your search index's when your "notes" get huge. Leave it, and add notes to it as you get them in this fashion, don't worry about organising them by subject, or organising them by priority or anything. Just have them in chunks seperated by the eeee sets.

Now every day, after you finish putting in your notes for the day into the document, hit ctrl+f, (the search function) and look for eeee. You should be brought to one of the "chunks" that were scheduled for today, read the first few words of each "note" and look away, try to recollect the rest of it, without looking, then check to see what you missed. Put specific emphasis to make sure you get it next time. Once finished, delete the eeee and add to the end of it another scheduled date.

Do this until you've finished all of the scheduled pieces for that specific day.

typically you want to be revising things in an exponentially increasing gap manner. That is once you've learnt it, you want to be exposed to it later on that day (while typing it into the computer), the next day, 3 days after that, a week after that, 3 weeks after that, month after that, 2 months after that etc...

This basically "locks" it in as perma-knowledge. Come exam time you won't even need to revise, as you wouldn't have forgotten anything.

Currently my "document" for revision is about 334 pages long, i go in every day, hit ctrl+f eeee, and revise what was schueduled to be revised today months ago, surprisingly i remember almost everything.

takes about 30 minutes or so revising each days quota, but itl'l save you cram session come exam time, and you get into a habit that even once exams are done, youl'l still return and spend 30 mins revising, thus the knowledge is not just memorized for the exam and forgotten, its YOUR knowledge. I'v even taken to adding random things i want to remember like birthdays to the document.
 
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