Aboriginal children in care now exceeds stolen generations (4 Viewers)

[katie tully]

Oh yes very good. The bleedin heart liberal tag slipped in without resorting to the cliche, good. Turning it into a left versus right issue very good indeed. Trying to claim the use of the racist tag quickly before it is used against you, interesting.

I assume when you talk about "them" you refer to advocates of reconciliation, like Peter Costello. So let's look at the solution, you, the tolerant, open minded, positive, compassionate people see as the solution. Effectively you're solution entails you paying less tax, or getting more spending, basically the solution that means you compassionate, tolerant people get a few more feathers for your nests.

You are commited to attacking those whom are in greatest need of improvement. I understand there is such a thing as "tough love" and I understand there are times where it is neccessary. However you would do well to learn the distinction between tough love and aggression. Libelling the communities of which I am fairly sure we all agree are in need of improvement is not tough love, it is simply adding insult to injury.

Your supposed solutions expect a community to recover from the sins of the past whilst those institutions which commited the sins deny them, suggest they were not sins at all but noble acts, that they should be thankful.

You advocate for crimes to go unpunished, for stolen wage to go unrepaid, for damages to not be met with compensation and yet you go onto complain that those who the crimes were commited against, the wages stolen from and the damage dealt to should feel no antipathy, no resentment at all about the whole affair.

On the rare occasion you extend your arm and advocate for reconciliation you write off the indigenous Australians as a lost cause for not all lining up to smoke the pipe of peace the day after it was offered. For not being able to brush off overnight over a century of genocide, stolen wages, land dispossession, stolen children, introduction of diseases and any number of other inequalities you accuse them of playing devils advocate. Never accepting any resolution for the sake of being difficult.

People like yourself only weigh in on the debate to assign blame, to accuse others of being ungrateful and soft would be better to just abstain and let those commited to improving the status quo do the weighing in.

Your supposed solutions rely on a heap of baseless and empty symbolism. What does reconciliation even mean?

 

[boris]

sorry

Edit: i lolled when i saw that coupled with my sig

 

[Lentern]

Your supposed solutions rely on a heap of baseless and empty symbolism. What does reconciliation even mean?

No I don't but you disgusting people only prove my point when you see just how important the apology and the redfern address were to indigenous communities and you go on passing them off as "baseless and empty symbolism." Symbols matter, a hell of a lot at that. It wasn't that the apology was just a symbol that you oppose it so, it's because it meant so much that you oppose it. It was because it was the government actually accepting guilt, it was an actual acknowlegement that the crowns representatives were practising discrimination and prejudice and that it was wrong. If these symbols were so meaningless, you people wouldn't be the ones allways bringing them up.

 

[sthcross.dude]

Your supposed solutions rely on a heap of baseless and empty symbolism. What does reconciliation even mean?

To be fair, he wasn't claiming he could solve the problem.

Merely why people weighing into the debate just to rant about tough love and how hopeless abos are is counter productive.

Pretty good rant imo.

 

[katie tully]

No I don't but you disgusting people only prove my point when you see just how important the apology and the redfern address were to indigenous communities and you go on passing them off as "baseless and empty symbolism." Symbols matter, a hell of a lot at that. It wasn't that the apology was just a symbol that you oppose it so, it's because it meant so much that you oppose it. It was because it was the government actually accepting guilt, it was an actual acknowlegement that the crowns representatives were practising discrimination and prejudice and that it was wrong. If these symbols were so meaningless, you people wouldn't be the ones allways bringing them up.

lol what, you guys are the ones always bringing it up. all i've seen from the three of you so far is 'yes but apology' 'yes but reconciliation' 'yes but LABOR'

And I'm asking so what? Now that it has been recognized and apologized for, what comes next?

 

[Lentern]

I dont get your point

Half the time, the majority of the rest of Australia's population has no respect for the head of government either. I don't see the rest of the population acting out because they haven't been pandered too.

They need to harden the fuck up and realise that there are 20 million other Australian's who aren't getting patted on the head.

Oh rubbish you don't get the point. You understand it entirely you just don't like it. Most Australians may think the government can be doing more, but very few think the government has no desire to make their life any better.

 

[katie tully]

Oh rubbish you don't get the point. You understand it entirely you just don't like it. Most Australians may think the government can be doing more, but very few think the government has no desire to make their life any better.

What more do you propose the government do?

 

[Lentern]

lol what, you guys are the ones always bringing it up. all i've seen from the three of you so far is 'yes but apology' 'yes but reconciliation' 'yes but LABOR'

And I'm asking so what? Now that it has been recognized and apologized for, what comes next?

That is wrong and you know it to be. Whenever a coalition supporter decides to assess the Rudd government the words "empty" and "symbolism" keep popping up over and over again.

I have said before that you can rush or force this but you need the opportunities to be available when the individual decides they want to have an education, they want to take strong care of their health and that of those around them that they don't simply give up because it is so difficult. It is also important that they're should never be a question of whether or not the broader community regrets the sins of the past were commited and there should never be any doubt as to whether or not the broader community is commited to repair the damage. That means awareness campaigns, that means frequent check ups and yes it means the right symbols are in place.

 

[boris]

My solution; Remove the abos

Edit: oh lol lol i meant alcohol and petrol etc





















Not really.















Ok a little..maybe

 

[Lentern]

What more do you propose the government do?

It can start by repaying the stolen wage and damages to the indigenous communities ideally through actual service grants as we all are aware of the shortcomings of simply handing out money.

 

[katie tully]

have said before that you can rush or force this but you need the opportunities to be available when the individual decides they want to have an education, they want to take strong care of their health and that of those around them that they don't simply give up because it is so difficult.

That's a ridiculous notion. If that's the case, all of you lollygaggers can stfu about the poor state of Aboriginal affairs. If, as you ascertain, we should just leave them to their own devices and hope they make the right choice in their own time, THEN WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENTLY TO WHAT IS THE CASE NOW.

And don't tell me the opportunities don't exist, because they do.

 

[katie tully]

It can start by repaying the stolen wage and damages to the indigenous communities ideally through actual service grants as we all are aware of the shortcomings of simply handing out money.

No.

What "stolen" wages.

 

[sthcross.dude]

It can start by repaying the stolen wage and damages to the indigenous communities ideally through actual service grants as we all are aware of the shortcomings of simply handing out money.

But most of the people who were wronged are dead.

 

[Lentern]

That's a ridiculous notion. If that's the case, all of you lollygaggers can stfu about the poor state of Aboriginal affairs. If, as you ascertain, we should just leave them to their own devices and hope they make the right choice in their own time, THEN WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENTLY TO WHAT IS THE CASE NOW.

And don't tell me the opportunities don't exist, because they do.

The difference would be nongs like yourself wouldn't be belittling the decision that is made, declaring the solution a failure after two weeks and a reinforced commitment to raise awareness of these opportunities. It's one thing for example to be able to simply be entitled to see a counsellor, it's a different matter to know how to act upon that entitlement and to be convinced it will be worth acting on that entitlement.

The status quo is not currently so horrendous, what is horrendous is all those who suggest that too much is set aside at the moment and that we should withdraw these opportunities. Those who suggest that because the opportunities are available the slate is now clean and that any inequalities that still exist are entirely the fault of those whom are disadvantaged.

 

[zstar]

Oh yes very good. The bleedin heart liberal tag slipped in without resorting to the cliche, good. Turning it into a left versus right issue very good indeed. Trying to claim the use of the racist tag quickly before it is used against you, interesting.

I assume when you talk about "them" you refer to advocates of reconciliation, like Peter Costello. So let's look at the solution, you, the tolerant, open minded, positive, compassionate people see as the solution. Effectively you're solution entails you paying less tax, or getting more spending, basically the solution that means you compassionate, tolerant people get a few more feathers for your nests.

You are commited to attacking those whom are in greatest need of improvement. I understand there is such a thing as "tough love" and I understand there are times where it is neccessary. However you would do well to learn the distinction between tough love and aggression. Libelling the communities of which I am fairly sure we all agree are in need of improvement is not tough love, it is simply adding insult to injury.

Your supposed solutions expect a community to recover from the sins of the past whilst those institutions which commited the sins deny them, suggest they were not sins at all but noble acts, that they should be thankful.

You advocate for crimes to go unpunished, for stolen wage to go unrepaid, for damages to not be met with compensation and yet you go onto complain that those who the crimes were commited against, the wages stolen from and the damage dealt to should feel no antipathy, no resentment at all about the whole affair.

On the rare occasion you extend your arm and advocate for reconciliation you write off the indigenous Australians as a lost cause for not all lining up to smoke the pipe of peace the day after it was offered. For not being able to brush off overnight over a century of genocide, stolen wages, land dispossession, stolen children, introduction of diseases and any number of other inequalities you accuse them of playing devils advocate. Never accepting any resolution for the sake of being difficult.

People like yourself only weigh in on the debate to assign blame, to accuse others of being ungrateful and soft would be better to just abstain and let those commited to improving the status quo do the weighing in.

I am not saying anybodies an angel what I am simply arguing is that the left wing always pretends to care but at the end of the day has no solution to the problem. They want to keep living in the past and keep making the same mistake expecting different results, That is the definition of an idiot.


My biggest problem with the whole establishment is that they keep using government to fix the problem of these people. Don't you see a pattern emerging here? First these government bums take their children away and dispossess their land then they come back a few decades later and act like they'll "fix" the problem by giving welfare and handouts while ignoring the fact that they do nothing but abuse themselves and each other.


That's what government does, They create the problems then they try to become the solution.


It does not work, It never has work and will never ever work.

 

[sthcross.dude]

I am not saying anybodies an angel what I am simply arguing is that the left wing always pretends to care but at the end of the day has no solution to the problem. They want to keep living in the past and keep making the same mistake expecting different results, That is the definition of an idiot.


My biggest problem with the whole establishment is that they keep using government to fix the problem of these people. Don't you see a pattern emerging here? First these government bums take their children away and dispossess their land then they come back a few decades later and act like they'll "fix" the problem by giving welfare and handouts while ignoring the fact that they do nothing but abuse themselves and each other.


That's what government does, They create the problems then they try to become the solution.


It does not work, It never has work and will never ever work.

So they government created the problem, but has no responsibility to try and fix it?

 

[katie tully]

The difference would be nongs like yourself wouldn't be belittling the decision that is made, declaring the solution a failure after two weeks and a reinforced commitment to raise awareness of these opportunities. It's one thing for example to be able to simply be entitled to see a counsellor, it's a different matter to know how to act upon that entitlement and to be convinced it will be worth acting on that entitlement.

The status quo is not currently so horrendous, what is horrendous is all those who suggest that too much is set aside at the moment and that we should withdraw these opportunities. Those who suggest that because the opportunities are available the slate is now clean and that any inequalities that still exist are entirely the fault of those whom are disadvantaged.

lol, I'm a nong?

Fuck you're out of touch man. They're well aware of what is available to them, and they're well aware of how to access it. They just can't be fucked.

I've seen it.

 

[Lentern]

No.

What "stolen" wages.

Hold on, I was under the impression you lot were calling us the hole pokers. declaring every answer unworkable. My observation is that any solution that costs a taxpayer something is declared unworkable by yourself.The wages which were not paid for indigenous labour which was for the large part completed as it ws there only way of accessing the land in which they held inextricable religious connections to.

 

[Lentern]

But most of the people who were wronged are dead.

I used the term "communities" deliberately.

 

[zstar]

So they government created the problem, but has no responsibility to try and fix it?

You'll one day come to learn that governments solution is as horrific as the problems they cause.