Does God exist? (5 Viewers)

[erin_tonkin]

Well how else are you supposed to have a relligion. Religion is all about faith and believing. What religion has been absolutely 100%proven?

 

[volition]

Well how else are you supposed to have a relligion. Religion is all about faith and believing. What religion has been absolutely 100%proven?

It appears that there is nothing I can do from here, as you've just retreated to the 'faith' defence. Thankyou for wasting my time.

 

[erin_tonkin]

Seriously answer my quuestion what religion doesnt rely solely on faith???

 

[funnybunny]

hey ignorant erin_tonkin

Maybe chrisitanity is the right religion but until it has been proven or any religion has been proven (which will obviously never be) we should not pretend to have studied otehr religions and have seen flaws in them.

 

[erin_tonkin]

I really have not much idea what you are talking about.

you seem to know nothing about bible history with your testament comment

i actually have studied the bible in depth, are you just trying to have a go? I find it rather rude.

maybe if you read the bible in full you would find it does not contradict, old testament means the old way, the old laws and then the new testament is the new way and new laws according to jesus christ

yes i totally agree. no religion has been proved. thats why you need faith. supposedly the "faith defence" but thats actually what happens.

yes i have one faith and i believe that it is the only one. that is what i said in my post

where are the contradictions. please tell me for i cannot see them.im very sorry if i have contradicted myself it was not my intention.

i understand maybe you cannot understand faith untill you have experienced it. Do you have faith that the sun will come up tomorow or would that be hiding behind the faith shield?

I have a friend who has studdied all religions greatly. He has studdied christianity and it is the only one he has found no flaw in. He is no ignoramus either. I myself have not studdied them as much but from hearing him speak i conclude that christianity is a strong faith that holds up against any argument.

Can I ask you what you believe. Where did life come from? WHere does it go?
Ive told you what I think can you tell me???

 

[volition]

I'm Atheist, and I'll believe something if that seems to be likely and explains why things are to me. Science has no real reason to lie, and if certain scientists did lie, they would be found out by their peers. Currently, I think the Big Bang theory explains things the best because evidence supports it (such as the expansion of the universe). I believe that life on earth happened through evolution, and the formation of life on earth was even supported by the Miller-Urey experiment done in 1953. As for where life goes, I think that this life is the only life that we get.

Speaking of the movements of the Sun, that's something we can observe, something we can actually see happening. I really don't think it takes much 'faith' (if any faith at all) to believe that the sun will rise the next morning, because scientists predict that it will continue to do this for a long time. They may be wrong, but at least there's some evidence(like their knowledge of the way the Sun works and what the Sun is made of) to back their claims, I see no evidence in your case Erin.

Alright then, let's see, do you believe in the following?:
1. God is omniscient
2. That God created the world
3. That we all have 'free will' ?

 

[withoutaface]

Seriously answer my quuestion what religion doesnt rely solely on faith???

Agnosticism.

 

[erin_tonkin]

yes on all three counts.

your big bang theory yes it seems like a likely explaination. When God said let there be light i imagine there would have been a bit of a bang. For a bang has to be formed from something,

what do you think that something was?

 

[erin_tonkin]

on the sun it was merely an example.
but you still have faith it will rise. faith through knowlege. the bible like your scientists tells me that God exists. I believe it like you believe them. And i trust it like you trust them.
Thats faith
Knowing believing and trusting
you understand the conccept

 

[erin_tonkin]

Agnosticism.

Agnosticisim requires the greatest ammount of faith of all. That God doesnt exist. How could you think that in a world as complex as ours?

 

[volition]

So you do believe in all 3? Well, I think you're wrong. How can it be possible for humans to have free will and for God to still know everything that we are going to do? It's either one or the other. Now, since God created the world (your belief, not mine), if he truly is omniscient, he must have known everything that would have happened, right up until now and even into the future. So it's not a question of "god knowing, and not forcing us to anything", because in effect, when he 'created the world' he must've known what would happen (if he's omniscient), so he really WAS causing us to do these things. It really is one or the other, take your pick

Do you believe in the bible literally? Because if you do, there are many many conflicting issues here. For example, God creates light before he creates the stars in the sky. How is that possible?

 

[volition]

Agnosticisim requires the greatest ammount of faith of all. That God doesnt exist. How could you think that in a world as complex as ours?

Are you trying to say that because our world is complex, it must've had a creator? Because that sounds an awful lot like Intelligent Design...

 

[volition]

on the sun it was merely an example.
but you still have faith it will rise. faith through knowlege. the bible like your scientists tells me that God exists. I believe it like you believe them. And i trust it like you trust them.
Thats faith
Knowing believing and trusting
you understand the conccept

I don't think you understand the point I was making. Scientists SEE the sun, you and I SEE the sun. NOBODY has seen God, because apparently if you saw God you'd die.

When you speak about 'faith through knowledge', where's your 'knowledge' part? I've shown you my 'knowledge' for believing in the Sun, so its ok for me to believe that the Sun will rise in the morning. Where's this 'knowledge' that your faith comes from? And if you're going to say 'the bible', then prove to me that its valid.

 

[erin_tonkin]

So you do believe in all 3? Well, I think you're wrong. How can it be possible for humans to have free will and for God to still know everything that we are going to do? It's either one or the other. Now, since God created the world (your belief, not mine), if he truly is omniscient, he must have known everything that would have happened, right up until now and even into the future. So it's not a question of "god knowing, and not forcing us to anything", because in effect, when he 'created the world' he must've known what would happen (if he's omniscient), so he really WAS causing us to do these things. It really is one or the other, take your pick

Do you believe in the bible literally? Because if you do, there are many many conflicting issues here. For example, God creates light before he creates the stars in the sky. How is that possible?

just because someone knows it doesnt mean they have control. God knows WHAT we will do but he didnt MAKE us do it

 

[erin_tonkin]

I don't think you understand the point I was making. Scientists SEE the sun, you and I SEE the sun. NOBODY has seen God, because apparently if you saw God you'd die.

When you speak about 'faith through knowledge', where's your 'knowledge' part? I've shown you my 'knowledge' for believing in the Sun, so its ok for me to believe that the Sun will rise in the morning. Where's this 'knowledge' that your faith comes from? And if you're going to say 'the bible', then prove to me that its valid.

knowledge is through the bible
which is a historically proven book
proove to me that it isnt....

 

[erin_tonkin]

Are you trying to say that because our world is complex, it must've had a creator? Because that sounds an awful lot like Intelligent Design...

and what is wrong with intelligent design?? Designer = God

 

[davin]

Agnosticisim requires the greatest ammount of faith of all. That God doesnt exist. How could you think that in a world as complex as ours?

thats not what agnostic is at all. The belief structure that is agnostic is that there are some things that we are not able to know, specifically, if there is a god or not. if i remember how it breaks down right, it would be that a- would mean not, and gnostic is, i think, tied to knowledge. but not entirely sure tahts the right word its linked to. In no way is it the belief that god doesn't exist, just the belief that we don't have the ability to know.

but you still have faith it will rise. faith through knowlege. the bible like your scientists tells me that God exists. I believe it like you believe them. And i trust it like you trust them.

its totally different. you believe the bible and its view of god because it says that it is the correct theological standpoint.
science is a constantly evolving process involving making hypotheses, testing theories, and comparing said theories to what is observed, and then adjusting those theories until they fully explain what is observed. there is no evolution to the bible to, say, adjust the age of the earth. those observations are just ignored. there is a difference between changing what you think to better represent what is observed (science) and ignoring some of what is observed so it continues to fit what you believe (religion).


and the big bang formed from a singularity. if you want to say that something had to have created the big bang, it couldn't have come from nowhere, or happened by itself, then where did God come from? as surely that had to come from somewhere.

 

[davin]

knowledge is through the bible
which is a historically proven book
proove to me that it isnt....

number one, even if one assumes that the bible, in its original incarnation, was fully accurate, there have been many errors as it has been translated over the years. For example, I recall reading that the Red Sea was never parted. Its a mistranslation and that it was actually, i believe the Reed Sea, which is not any clearly esablished body of water, but is thought to have been a relativly small and shallow body.

number two, if i recall correctly, the Bible says, in its history of the earth, taht it is...i think 6000 years old? However that number is in no way even close to being accurate. As that falls under a historical context, that is wrong.

number three, the burden of proof is not up to others to show that the bible is wrong, its up to you to show that it IS historically accurate. If i say i can fly, does that mean i can up until the point you disprove my claim? No, I would have to prove I can fly because the burden of proof is on me in that case.

 

[erin_tonkin]

well agnosticisim does not seem like a religion. more a school of thought


Are you saying that science then is more reliable? I beg to differ. Scientists are constantly changing there hypothesis as they descover they are wrong however christianity is solid as a rock. It has stayed the same since the begining of time.

Creation and the promise of Jesus right through to Jesus and the promise of salvation. Yesterday today tomorow it is the same God.

As to the finer points of lfe such as the age of the earth etc. Do these points matter. WHen it all boils down to it are these the questions we need to ask? I would have thought the more relevant question was the WHO and not the HOW or WHEN. The Bible tells us that God crreated the world and that is enough for me. It may have taken 7 days or 7 billion years. I dont think it matters.

Where did God come from. I dont know. God is God and he always was

 

[erin_tonkin]

number one, even if one assumes that the bible, in its original incarnation, was fully accurate, there have been many errors as it has been translated over the years. For example, I recall reading that the Red Sea was never parted. Its a mistranslation and that it was actually, i believe the Reed Sea, which is not any clearly esablished body of water, but is thought to have been a relativly small and shallow body.

that is not the point of the story. Even if you are correct which i doubt, the point is that God saved his people from slavery


number two, if i recall correctly, the Bible says, in its history of the earth, taht it is...i think 6000 years old? However that number is in no way even close to being accurate. As that falls under a historical context, that is wrong.

I dont knoww where you got that figure from but i dont think it was from the bible.

number three, the burden of proof is not up to others to show that the bible is wrong, its up to you to show that it IS historically accurate. If i say i can fly, does that mean i can up until the point you disprove my claim? No, I would have to prove I can fly because the burden of proof is on me in that case.

what about innocent until proven guilty. It is a highly respected text among historians not just christians. It has been supported by many other texts as well. There is bucketloads of evidence if you care to search