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I'm happy to criticise Shorten too, there's no hypocrisy here. Also I don't see where I assume your views, other than in your capacity as a member of the the Liberal party.

To your last paragraph, this isn't really true in principle but might be if your definition of left-wing is Clintonite neoliberals. Still I'd say the deregulation of the finance sector, abolishment of the fiduciary rule and other measures which ease the ability to prey on vulnerable people tip the balance in the favour of the Right.

I would agree that being Conservative doesn't mean maintaining the status quo, it does have ideology (traditional values, free market)
Don't get me wrong. I didn't mean to imply that you are hypocritical. Rather, I was suggesting that despite left-wing rhetoric, many on the Left are hypocritical as evidenced by their actions, not necessarily my assumptions.

Well just saying that it isn't true doesn't make it so. The fact of the matter is wherever you have a concentration of power, whether it be in government or labour, it just breeds corruption and avarice. If you equate a free market with 'tipping the balance in favour of the Right' then you are correct. However, a truly free market is not what we've been seeing; all we have seen is this mixed-up cronyist system. In a free market, the onus is on the individual to make the right decisions, with businesses penalised by their customers (or lack thereof) for potentially predatory practices. Anything more just advantages the very systems you're trying to contain by making it more difficult for smaller firms, which often lack access to the resources required to navigate through the smokescreen of legislation and regulation. Ultimately, this lack of competition helps big business.
 
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cosmo 2

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lib/labs should be banned as political parties imo, like the communist party after the collapse of the soviet union was. they are dangerous political entities that mainly only operate to sustain or continue to inflate real estate values (australia is effectively a propertyocracy at this point) and must be destroyed.
 
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lib/labs should be banned as political parties imo, like the communist party after the collapse of the soviet union was. they are dangerous political entities that mainly only operate to sustain or continue to inflate real estate values (australia is effectively a propertyocracy at this point) and must be destroyed.
Oh please, this isn't the first time we've this kind of issue and it certainly won't be the last. Don't you know about the 17% interest rates under Hawke and Keating? They practically eviscerated the first home-buying market.

I get young people's gripe with high property prices but let's look at it from a different perspective. Sure, it makes purchasing your first home incredibly difficult, but that's more of a problem for Millennials and the Z's; everyone else who owns property, our parents, investors and others, are also seeing the value of their property skyrocket to their great financial benefit.

I won't deny Asian investment bumps up prices, but IMHO the real issue is the huge amount of demand and comparatively little supply. A lot of that is due to lethargic councils and ridiculously gratuitous regulations which add time and cost to the process of developing land.
 

cosmo 2

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rofl we are living in the most severe housing bubble this country has ever seen, and very probably the worst housing/asset valuation bubble the world has ever seen. the total dwelling valuation stock to GDP ratio has risen from an (already very high) 200% in the late 1990s when the valuation bubble started inflation to around 360% today. australian household debt (mostly bound up in home repayment debt) is the highest in the world, and median property price to local income ratios are extraordinarily skewed, especially in melbourne and sydney (respectively around 10x and 12x). outside of hong kong, sydney is now the most expensive city in the world. this is not justifiable given its relatively unimportant position within the global economy.



the bubble kicked off some time in the late 1990s when john howard cut the capital gains tax rate on residential property. it has since skyrocketed lockstep with the massive increases in immigration and dodgy foreign purchases that have occurred over the past 15 years.

the 17% interest rate point is not useful for establishing any point about relative housing unaffordability because it is a static measure and only takes into account interest rates at the time the measure was made; it does not clarify on housing affordability over the full life of the mortgage (nor does it take into account higher required deposits - another substantial hurdle to affordability). while interest rates have substantially declined, principal payments have skyrocketed;



paradoxically the low interest rate is a contributing cause of the bubble, as it interminably juices demand and specufestor fervor.

the lack of supply is probably a canard: there's plenty of supply, it just gets snapped up by speculators, foreign buyers and migrants. a genuine housing supply shortage would see corresponding rental price growth in conjunction with property price growth, but this is not the case. and anyway, if there is something to this idea it wouldn't matter; supply gets snapped up by specufestor maniacs, foreign buyers and immigrants. it doesnt matter how much gets freed up if it keeps getting pulled off the shelves faster than you can stock them.

the final suggestion of yours, that somehow exorbitant and divorced-from-fundamentals housing prices is an economic good is just crazy. this kind of unrestrained speculation is not just bad because it impacts upon the young and the vulnerable to purchase property; it massively distorts the economy, diverts investment streams to an ultimately unproductive sector, raises fundamental input costs, drives away valuable economic activity, endangers our natural and built environment and renders us very susceptible to external economic shocks (seriously -- next time the global economy goes kaput we're cooked). all of the main parties, including the greens, are complicit in this nightmare.
 
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aidan059

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Proud member of the NSW Young Greens, NSW Greens and the Australian Greens. Labor and Libs can go fuck themselves with their bi-partisan regressive anti-environment, anti-refugee, anti-multicultural platforms, and One Nation.... don't even get me started. And whichever idiot thinks that Libs prime ministers have been more successful than Labor's is joking, who have you had in recent years? Abbott a fucktard right wing christian nutter, Turnbull a pro-coal, backflipping billionaire crony. Don't get me started on Howard, you'll pull out the old firearms argument that he was so successful. Congrats anyone could of done that, meanwhile keeping you distracted domestically, he started WW3 with Bush in Afghanistan and fucked over the whole of the middle east in combination with the US. THANK YOU LIBS FOR ALL YOUR GREAT PMs!
 

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