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The Bible is America's favourite book (1 Viewer)

law

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Do atheists have no faith? I mean, atheists cannot disprove God's existence, therefore atheism is based on the FAITH that God doesn't exist.

Anyway, if atheism is more of a "doubting God" then it would be the same as agnosticism.

Ok, I can understand that atheists are adamant about there being no God but agnosticism is something I fail to properly understand.

I mean, everyone doubts things from time to time, even Jesus during his time but I believe each human should move on from this doubt. Isn't having a life all about moving on and progressing?

I'm reading "Life of Pi" at the moment and I came across this line:

"To chose doubt as a philosophy is akin to choosing immobility as a means of transportation."

The whole idea doesn't really make sense to me...
 

Gay Captain

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law said:
Do atheists have no faith? I mean, atheists cannot disprove God's existence, therefore atheism is based on the FAITH that God doesn't exist.

Anyway, if atheism is more of a "doubting God" then it would be the same as agnosticism.

Ok, I can understand that atheists are adamant about there being no God but agnosticism is something I fail to properly understand.

I mean, everyone doubts things from time to time, even Jesus during his time but I believe each human should move on from this doubt. Isn't having a life all about moving on and progressing?

I'm reading "Life of Pi" at the moment and I came across this line:

"To chose doubt as a philosophy is akin to choosing immobility as a means of transportation."

The whole idea doesn't really make sense to me...
You could say you can't disprove the existence of pixies, therefore someone who doesn't believe that pixies are exist is using faith. You can't prove the negative of the physical existence of anything. So you have to admit you're only agnostic about pixies and cosmic teapots and anything else I can dream up. If you're only an agnostic about pixies (you "doubt" they exist) should you 'move forward' by now believing in them?

Not believing in something because there's no reason to at this stage is different from having faith. Other people explain this heaps better in the does god exist? thread.

On the other point, remember an atheist could be a marxist or maybe a humanist or an existentialist some other philosophy, it's not like a school of thought, it's just saying you don't believe in god because you don't see any evidence for it.

The idea is sort that you don't make any claims about something you can't possibly know; theists don't just claim that they are certain that god exists, they also claim to know his will/mind.
 

Trajan

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Gay Captain,

It's like there's two different posters using your account. Most of the time you are brain-dead.

On rare occasions you present decent arguments about a variety of topics.

You truly are an enigma.:confused:
 

HalcyonSky

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TacoTerrorist said:
/facepalm

Get a clue you fucking waste of space. Lord Hawthorn is far more intelligent than half you pseudo-intellectual 17yo atheist cocksuckers.
pseudo-intellectual. lolol. So what's your take on religion? I want to hear some real intellectual shit, some tip top arguments i've never heard before, ones that will change my life. Plz?

I tend to be hostile towards religion because it gets so much more respect than it deserves. If the level of science we have today was around when humans were first able to question their surroundings, i believe its highly likely religion wouldnt be half as prominent as it is today
 
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KFunk

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law said:
Life: Torch goes on
Death: Torch goes out

WOW... that's believable - when you're on your death bed, your views will soon change. Happens all the time.
But do their views change because there exist moments of hyper-rationality amongst the general cognitive decline, or as an emotional shield against the existential anxiety brought on by the inevitability of death/nothingness?


law said:
Do atheists have no faith? I mean, atheists cannot disprove God's existence, therefore atheism is based on the FAITH that God doesn't exist.

Anyway, if atheism is more of a "doubting God" then it would be the same as agnosticism.

Ok, I can understand that atheists are adamant about there being no God but agnosticism is something I fail to properly understand.

I mean, everyone doubts things from time to time, even Jesus during his time but I believe each human should move on from this doubt. Isn't having a life all about moving on and progressing?

I'm reading "Life of Pi" at the moment and I came across this line:

"To chose doubt as a philosophy is akin to choosing immobility as a means of transportation."

The whole idea doesn't really make sense to me...
You misappropriate the Life of Pi quote. The kind of doubt practiced there is more akin to the Pyrrhonian Skepticism described by Sextus Empiricus which involves suspending belief with regards to everything. Atheists don't practice a philosophy of doubt any more than most theists who similarly deny the existence of a great number of culturally prominent entities, e.g. Zeus, the Sphinx and Valkyries . It's not about doubting for doubt's sake, it's about sound intellectual practice, burden of proof and deference to the best available explanation (aided along the way by Ockham's Razor). Do you think it is reasonable to believe in Valkyries right off the bat, in the absence of evidence? I certainly don't. I merely extend this same reasoning to the judeo-christian god and many other entities. Formally I am an agnostic because I am similarly yet to see a knock down argument against god (though I lean on the side of atheists in terms of the broad balance of evidence).

Once more, agnosticism is not about 'doubt', it is about intellectual honesty and following the evidence. If researchers didn't use an appropriate level of agnosticism (in non-god domains) we would suffer from the innappropriate use of drugs and all other sorts of technology, e.g. suppose a drug trial is being conducted and it is unclear whether the drug in question is beneficial or harmful. Is it really appropriate for the researchers to say "I'm going to cast away this life of doubt!" and subsequently claim that the drug is beneficial (or, alternatively, that it is harmful) without evidence either way? No, it is throroughly inappropriate because if they are wrong they will harm people, either by giving them something harmful or by omitting something beneficial. Etc... Etc... The agnostic position is intellectually healthy when used in the right situations.
 
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^CoSMic DoRiS^^

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law said:
I love it how at the mention of religion people feel the need to trash and mock it. How about we look into the credibility of atheists having no beliefs and no sacred texts whatsoever.

How about their little "torch" theory.

Life: Torch goes on
Death: Torch goes out

WOW... that's believable - when you're on your death bed, your views will soon change. Happens all the time.
Um, that is believable. Explain why it's not?

Anyway, believing in something with no credible evidence to back it up is far less reasonable than refusing to believe in something until evidence is given. I'm an atheist, but if a solid, irrefutable argument ever emerged to prove the existence of God, I'd stop being an atheist, because I wouldn't logically be able to be one if a God was proven to exist. It'd be like saying I didn't believe in milk or something equally stupid. That's not to say I'd become religious. But I'd believe in God if it was proven to me beyond all reasonable doubt that he/it was real. However I'm pretty sure my belief would be the same thing as my belief in milk - it's there. I don't really have any feelings towards it one way or another, but I acknowledge that it is sitting there in my fridge. Behold.

Sorry to use such a weak analogy, I'm not really in the mood to think deeply about this. Just thought I'd chuck in a comment for the hell of it.
 

TacoTerrorist

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pseudo-intellectual. lolol. So what's your take on religion? I want to hear some real intellectual shit, some tip top arguments i've never heard before, ones that will change my life. Plz?
I'd share my take on religion but since you're almost definitely an atheist (and hence close minded, intolerant and hostile) I won't share the finer details of it. However, I will say that I find it hard to believe the scientific explanation of how this incredibly complex earth was formed and created.

I tend to be hostile towards religion because it gets so much more respect than it deserves.
What respect? There is very little, especially because of the fading influence of previous generations. I know very few church-goers, and most people are apathetic or disinterested in it.

If the level of science we have today was around when humans were first able to question their surroundings, i believe its highly likely religion wouldnt be half as prominent as it is today
I agree. Am I to infer that you believe religion is something to comfort the stupid and the weak?
 

HalcyonSky

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TacoTerrorist said:
I'd share my take on religion but since you're almost definitely an atheist (and hence close minded, intolerant and hostile) I won't share the finer details of it. However, I will say that I find it hard to believe the scientific explanation of how this incredibly complex earth was formed and created.



What respect? There is very little, especially because of the fading influence of previous generations. I know very few church-goers, and most people are apathetic or disinterested in it.



I agree. Am I to infer that you believe religion is something to comfort the stupid and the weak?
you get offended when i clarify there's a difference between the theory of evolution and the fact of evolution, you say the earth is irreducibly complex, and yet you have the nerve to call me closed minded?

heh.
 
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Slidey

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Gay Captain said:
lol

MY VIEWS ARE TOO COMPLEX 4 U
lol. Yeah it's not exactly a strong argument is it?
 

TacoTerrorist

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you get offended when i clarify there's a difference between the theory of evolution and the fact of evolution, you say the earth is irreducibly complex, and yet you have the nerve to call me closed minded?

heh.
...huh?
 

zstar

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I don't understand this backlash against Christianity.

So there's a few rotten eggs posing as Christians, It doesn't mean you have to insult every believer.

The Bible is profound, The humanist laws of this country are based on Christian belief. That is why you're not being butchered by Atheist rulers who don't believe in a God so they don't fear any consequence.
 

HalcyonSky

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zstar said:
The Bible is profound, The humanist laws of this country are based on Christian belief. That is why you're not being butchered by Atheist rulers who don't believe in a God so they don't fear any consequence.
Actually, its the religious rulers that butchered the atheist non believers. Take a history lesson you fuckstick.
And im not even going to bother debating the roots of morality.

It's the self centered naivity of you christians that makes me so furious. I probably wouldn't have profanities in my vocabulary if it wasnt for some of the posts ive seen on these forums

EDIT: you're a troll, right?
 
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zstar

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HalcyonSky said:
Actually, its the religious rulers that butchered the atheist non believers. Take a history lesson you fuckstick.
And im not even going to bother debating the roots of morality.

It's the self centered naivity of you christians that makes me so furious. I probably wouldn't have profanities in my vocabulary if it wasnt for some of the posts ive seen on these forums

EDIT: you're a troll, right?
You sound angry.

You need Jesus to help you with that anger problem, Maybe you were abused or bullied?

God loves you remember that.
 

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