UTS has TWO courses with a 99.9 cut-off this year :x (2 Viewers)

[msh]

No.



No.

UAI cut-off means absolutely nothing in the real world. If I saw someone put their UAI on their CV, I'd chuck it out pretty much, basically means "this guy is a pompous arse".

Anyone who thinks some dude who graduated with a B Design from UTS is more valuable than a doctor, a solicitor, a natural scientist, an engineer or an accountant (maybe not the ones out of HK) is stupid. Without science there would be no design or aesthetics.

When I used that comparison I compared it in terms of coveted job titles, due to these constant rise in design cut-offs, and now it even reaching an unbelievable 99.9.
Of course if we are measuring by how valuable certain job is in a life and death situation, doctors will always be number one priority, followed by teachers in my opinion.

But with the recent lifestyle of many of australians, an average person can afford to dine out, spend money on luxury items and holidays, I guess there's room for luxury expenses like design. Course choices are personal decisions and it would be unfair to try to pigeon hold someone who obviously worked hard to compete, and tell them they are inferior simply because they chose to be designers instead of doctors or lawyers. UAC and career advisors do promote choosing degrees based upon personal interest not what the society or your parents value anyway.

I just found it fascinating that more people with one of the highest uais that literally opened up every single door in terms of degree choosing are turning their heads into a career unheard of 50 years ago and wanted to know what could be causing it.

 

[jb_nc]

Also absolutely no competition for good, well-paying jobs with heaps of benefits and post-graduate studies aren't completely tyrannously cut-throat.

I love science. I can't wait to walk into either a doctorate or a job for like $55-60k straight out of uni.

 

[msh]

I love and hate how no one wants to do engineering

Hate: Less ppl to make as friends

Love: More money, engineers salaries are going 3 times higher inflation and it dont look like its stopping

Also absolutely no competition for good, well-paying jobs with heaps of benefits and post-graduate studies aren't completely tyrannously cut-throat.

I love science. I can't wait to walk into either a doctorate or a job for like $55-60k straight out of uni.

It's true...

Higher competition means obviously higher cattiness with neck to neck and cut-throat competition. Being 'competent' isn't good enough in an industry like design, as the majority are probably over competent and the market size isn't going to get any bigger.
In fact I remember reading an article in the UK about the rise of fashion design popularity in comparison to the actual market. From my memory it stated up to 1000 fashion grads each year would be jobless.

I think the movie Devil Wears Prada depicted the reality of the design industry pretty well. 'Millions of girls would kill for this job.' Despite the job requiring to deal with boss from hell with a measly wage.

Earnings in these industries can be anything from billions to nothing. I guess people are trying to better their chances of succeeding by beating the competition, by trying to get into reputable design schools like the UTS one, thus the ridiculously HIGH cut-offs caused by the stiff cut-throat competition and the already saturated reality of the industry.

On the other hand, there are skills/grad shortages in field of sciences and engineering, with 50k+ titles WAITING to be grabbed :uhhuh:

 

[A High Way Man]

You don't need to go to university to design.

 

[msh]

You don't need to go to university to design.

But it would better their chances of actually surviving and making it to the top in the cut-throat industry that it already is with a degree, hence the stiff uai competition. Design industry is renowned for being catty and cut-throat and ultra competitive, having that extra 'edge' would most definitely benefit in the long term. Watch the Devil Wears Prada. :jaw:

Also, same could be said about many other industries, even engineering, i believe doesn't 'require' a university degree, but obviously it would help. You don't need a commerce/business degree to be eligible to open a business, same formula.

 

[jb_nc]

Also, same could be said about many other industries, even engineering, i believe doesn't 'require' a university degree, but obviously it would help. You don't need a commerce/business degree to be eligible to open a business, same formula.

No, to be a CPEng i.e. a charted professional engineer (that's a real engineer) you need a Bachelor's degree with honours and a few years of experience. People are allowed to call themselves "engineers" but only CPEngs are the real deal (it's actually illegal to call yourself a charted professional engineer without having the qualifications).

CPEngs are the ones who sign off in a design project and are the ones liable for a malfunction.

 

[msh]

No, to be a CPEng i.e. a charted professional engineer (that's a real engineer) you need a Bachelor's degree with honours and a few years of experience.

Please do not cheapen our industry. People are allowed to call themselves "engineers" but only CPEngs are the real deal (it's actually illegal to call yourself a charted professional engineer without having the qualifications).

CPEngs are the ones who sign off in a design project and are the ones liable for a malfunction.

That's interesting.. So are those engineers with tafe diplomas fakes?

 

[jb_nc]

That's interesting.. So are those engineers with tafe diplomas fakes?

Yes.

http://www.getchartered.org/requirements.htm
http://www.engineersaustralia.org.au/education/chartered-status/chartered-status.cfm

 

[Azamakumar]

Anyone with a tafe diploma is shit.

 

[poppop]

Anyone with a tafe diploma is shit.

I think this sort of attitude (which is quiet common) is also another reason why nowadays people are turning to university to become designers, hence the 99.9 cut-off for uts design this year.

 

[Azamakumar]

I'm a business/science student.

 

[poppop]

I'm a business/science student.

i'm just saying that attitude in general is why more people are turning to study at universities instead

At least it was for me as well, my parents would of been disappointed if i didn't choose to go to uni, not like I wasn't going to anyway

 

[Azamakumar]

A tafe diploma wont get me anywhere. Most of the time it's essentially the only option.

 

[msh]

we should keep this thread on track from now.

 

[~kiki]

The explanation is quite simple. UTS introduced a bonus scheme.

Basically, if you have done certain subjects which they believe will aid you in succeeding in the course, then you receive bonus points. The allocation of bonus points depends on the band you received in the course and the most bonus points you can receive is 5. They are added automatically to your uai when preferences are being processed.

For example. I receive a UAI of 96.15 and I have done both Textiles and Design and Visual Arts, subjects relevant to the bonus scheme for Interior Design. I achieve band 6 in both subjects and for this reason the maximum amount of bonus points are added to my UAI. My uai is entered as 100... Even if I received only one band 6 in either of these subjects, or maybe two band 4's I would still receive the maximum amount of bonus points. UNSW has released a similar scheme, however, in their case, they give out less bonus points... in fact, I don't think you receive bonus points if you acheive bonus points for band 4's.

 

[msh]

The explanation is quite simple. UTS introduced a bonus scheme.

Basically, if you have done certain subjects which they believe will aid you in succeeding in the course, then you receive bonus points. The allocation of bonus points depends on the band you received in the course and the most bonus points you can receive is 5. They are added automatically to your uai when preferences are being processed.

For example. I receive a UAI of 96.15 and I have done both Textiles and Design and Visual Arts, subjects relevant to the bonus scheme for Interior Design. I achieve band 6 in both subjects and for this reason the maximum amount of bonus points are added to my UAI. My uai is entered as 100... Even if I received only one band 6 in either of these subjects, or maybe two band 4's I would still receive the maximum amount of bonus points. UNSW has released a similar scheme, however, in their case, they give out less bonus points... in fact, I don't think you receive bonus points if you acheive bonus points for band 4's.

I think the introduction of the bonus scheme simply attracted more people, but for those two visual comm and fashion design courses to have a 99.9 cut-off, there has to of been enough legitimate 99.9 + students to cut it at that.

Think about it, considering there are two members on this forum with a 97.7 and 96.15 who both got into Interior Design, yet the official cut-off for interior is 84.55.

Why didn't UTS choose to pretend as if the cut off is 99.9 for Interior Design as well and accept you guys considering both of you did get band 6 in visual arts. which would of put poppop at 102.7 and kiki at 101.15 in terms of their entrance rank.

Also with the bonus scheme, the competitive entry mark is no longer out of 100 but 105. They can't consider everyone above 95 with a band 6 in visual arts all 100.

but anyways, congrats to you kiki for getting your first preference, good job

 

[~kiki]

I think the introduction of the bonus scheme simply attracted more people, but for those two visual comm and fashion design courses to have a 99.9 cut-off, there has to of been enough legitimate 99.9 + students to cut it at that.

Think about it, considering there are two members on this forum with a 97.7 and 96.15 who both got into Interior Design, yet the official cut-off for interior is 84.55.

Why didn't UTS choose to pretend as if the cut off is 99.9 for Interior Design as well and accept you guys considering both of you did get band 6 in visual arts. which would of put poppop at 102.7 and kiki at 101.15 in terms of their entrance rank.

Also with the bonus scheme, the competitive entry mark is no longer out of 100 but 105. They can't consider everyone above 95 with a band 6 in visual arts all 100.

but anyways, congrats to you kiki for getting your first preference, good job

there are only about 100 or so people in the state who a acheive 99.9?... its like top 0.01 percentile isn't iy?


and thank you ...

 

[loser101]

that jsut sux.

if i got a uai of 99.85 and couldnt get in, and someone got 90 and got in, i'd be real pissed.

 

[miikahansen]

This seems right.

I have been reading numerous articles on the shortage of engineers and scientists lately, and the courses becoming less popular these days. This has been noticed by others as well.

Have a look at this article titled 'Which Degree? Fashion Design or Science?' published in 2007.

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=5528

I also remember reading a similar article on the Sydney Morning Herald in 2007 about Design degrees becoming harder to get into than Science degrees.

I do also think the high 99.9 cut-offs for design degrees is an adverse reaction from the science and engineering degrees becoming less popular these days.

This is an international movement, even in the USA, one of the most prestigious design school, Rhode Island School of Design is considered to be the 'new ivy league' of art schools, and I forgot the name of the Japanese one but there is one that is considered their 'ivy league' of creative arts learning.

Also reputable and influential magazines like Business Week has been publishing articles like this in 2007:

'CEOs Must Be Designers, Not Just Hire Them. Think Steve Jobs And iPhone.'

http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/NussbaumOnDesign/archives/2007/06/ceos_must_be_de.html#comments

No one can underestimate the influence of design on the recent success of the iPod. Cuz I must add, it's rather crappy in terms of technical features and it breaks so easily, but that didn't stop it from selling like pancakes thanks to its cool creative advertising and product design.

Perhaps the high cut-offs are a reaction from all of those cultural shifts.

Well in particular in Australia yes, more young people want to study something interesting, exciting and possibly are more aware of where they see themselves down the road. Everyone wants to do some creative thus, standards have to go even higher to discriminate those who can really cut above the rest and those who truely do have what it takes.

I still think the cut-offs are because of an even higher demand for the course accompanied with managable resources and physical places. Added to this the bonus scheme.

Interesting remark you put forward about Rhode. Well really, a lot of other schools are in the same echelon like Parsons, Pratt, Cooper Union, School of Visual Arts, Yale (Grad only). Rhode I guess is now even more forth going since the new President is John Maeda. You can read about him both here:

http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2007/announcement-risd-1222.html
http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/next/archives/2007/12/and_risds_new_p.html#more

 

[miikahansen]

Coming back to this thread briefly and on the topic of a design education, I think instead of this area of study being dis-integrated in the way it is offered at one institution and another but not somewhere else, could the state Government or in somewhere senior industry people could form a entirely new large instiutional complex for creative arts only? That way, large amounts of recsources could come together to form offfering programmes of major studies like fine arts, performing, fashion.
I don't think the place has to be huge, just big enough that if offers something quite different whilst not hurting the existing universities since Australia's population isn't much.